Nic 00:02

You start making a list of like, what's problem we're trying to solve, and who can help us solve it, and who knows who. And then you just lose any fear of conflict or rejection or anything, and you just pick up the phone or start sending out emails and then one thing leads to another, and you start exploring. And I think you just do.

Leah 00:22

Hi, thanks for being here, and welcome to Season Two of The Founder Mindset, brought to you by ATB. I'm Leah Sarich, your host, and I'm super excited to talk to more Founders about the human experience of being an entrepreneur. In this podcast, we're digging into what it really feels like to build a company from nothing. I was a broadcaster for over 20 years. So, I've interviewed thousands of people, but entrepreneurs, not that many. And yet, they have the best stories. They're solving big problems and they're creating incredible impact. But it is hard work. So, why would they do this? Let's find out.

Leah 01:12

Joining me in the studio today is Nic Beique, founder and CEO of Helcim, a payments company that helps Canadian and American businesses accept credit cards at affordable and transparent rates. Hey, Nic.

Nic 01:25

Hey, thanks for having me.

Leah 01:26

Thank you so much for being here. It's so great to have you in the studio, too.

Nic 01:29

Yeah, I got a tour of the Thin Air Labs that was pretty exciting.

Leah 01:32

Pretty cool, right?

Nic 01:34

It's cool to see just all these startups in Calgary, like, you know, trying to find their space, and then some of them growing into bigger ones, and it's exciting.

Leah 01:42

It really is exciting. It's so fun to see them right there and then see them grow up and mature and go out and leave the nest. It's wonderful.

Nic 01:49

If you think ten years ago, when I got into my first startup, there was so little in Calgary to the point where you would say, Oh, I'm gonna go in tech, or I'm gonna do my IT company and my tech company, or whatever was the case. People would look at you funny, like, it's like, no, you graduated, and then you went to oil and gas, and you got a good job starting, and that's what you did. And there's anything else, like, just made no sense.

Leah 02:11

Right? And I know this because I worked in television in this city for 20 years, and, you know, once I discovered the tech sector, I was like, Wait a second, guys, how come we didn't have these people on our show like all the time. They have the best stories. And I phoned up all my friends at all the other TV stations, and I was like, Did you guys know about this? And they were like, No. And I'm like, me either. So, I agree with you. I completely agree with you that it's really a sector that's coming alive right now.

Nic 02:36

Yeah, I remember looking up; this is about, probably, eight years ago, or something about what new stories were made from, like Alberta media on any kind of tech story. And we found three, like, literally three. And there was one on the smart board, like the smart. Like an OG Calgary company, yeah. There's one on Solium, which became Chairworks, yeah. And there was one on, like, the early rise of Benevity. And I was like, that was it? There's just, like–

Leah 03:03

Only the ones that became the unicorns, right? Yeah, well, we'll just have to create some more then.

Nic 03:07

Yeah, I think one thing that Calgary, or just Alberta, needs is that we don't have our own kind of media. And when I say media could be more newsletters or podcasts, or there isn't enough of it, that is kind of homegrown. Because if you think about it, like, you know, Silicon Valley, they have TechCrunch, they have, you know, like The Verge, they have so many things that surround that there's a bit of a self-serving element. It gets to amplify the stories of their homegrown industry, right? And even in Canada, you have maybe, like, BetaKit, but that's very Toronto-based, and we kind of get scrum the crumbs here, right? But Alberta really hasn't, you know, and it's good to see podcasts like this because we need, yeah, more local media that talks about local tech because, if not, like, you know, nobody's going to do it for us, right? We need to do, put a spotlight on these companies.

Leah 03:55

Agreed. I mean, that's one of the main reasons why we started a podcast like this and why Thin Air Labs hired a former journalist, you know, and created a role called head of story, right? So, we know we need that. So, yeah, thank you again for doing it, and that's why we're here today. So, why don't we go right back to the beginning? Ah, when did you first figure out that you wanted to be an entrepreneur? It started really early for you, didn't it?

Nic 04:16

Yeah. I mean, I was probably my first kind of start, I was 15 years old, and I started making websites. So, this is, like, the late 90s. I'm aging myself, but it was, like, at the time, everybody thought they needed a website. It was kind of like the.com bubble and down to things that we kind of take for granted now, but like, you would go, I would get my haircut at my barber, and then, you know, we get talking, and I would say, I make websites. He's like, Oh, well, can you make a website for me? I'll pay you a couple of 100 bucks, right? And you're like, Okay. And then the local gym and the local computer store. One of my first clients was I walked into those that are kind of Calgary based, they'll know, Memory Express Computer store, right? Yeah. I walked in; there was one location. I went up to one of the brothers or the owner, and I was like, your website is terrible. You have no e-commerce, and I'd love to build your website. And they actually hired me as a job, and this was in high school, so I kind of moved my classes around. I worked there in the afternoons for eight bucks an hour, and I started coding their website. So, that's kind of how I got my entrepreneurial bug.

Leah 05:20

Yeah, but I need to, like, pull on a string there, like, you walked into the store and was like, Hey, your website sucks. Let me fix it for you. Where did you get the moxie to do something like that?

Nic 05:30

I don't know. I just, I'm still fairly introverted, but I had enough confidence about, you know, the websites I was building, and it was a story I really liked, and I put the two and two together, and just, I don't know, I just got the guts to say it, and, you know, work there for, you know, during a period of time in high school, and then realized, like, ultimately, I like doing it on my own more, and kind of spun off. And that was probably the official forming of my first company, which was called Blue Sphere Graphics. I don't know why. Don't ask a 15-year-old, like, how they came up with a business name, but and that was a web design company, and that's really. I love the fact I fell in love with just being an entrepreneur and being able to, like, have that success, and at a time being so young, yet, you know, more established, you know, real business people, real small businesses owners, saying, Yeah, I'll write you a check if you do this for me. And I thought that was so cool. And it just kind of evolved into it. And I fell in love with just working for myself because I just felt like I could deliver on things, I had control, and something clicks where you just start thinking, like, I'll never work for anybody else, I'll just do this thing.

Leah 06:40

And then you touched on it briefly. But what is it that you love about just being your own boss and, you know, not having to report to anybody?

Nic 06:47

I think there's a couple of elements. There's just an element of control for better, for worse. It's funny, because, in one way, you have less control because you're kind of, you're hunting day to day to be able to feed yourself. And you know, you would think like a corporate structure where you get a, you know, a job, and work through a corporate ladder like would give you more or at least a clearer path, but you just feeling completely in control is a big thing. And the other thing was probably a little bit of a streak of anti-authority. I've never done well in school. I always skipped class. I always want to do my own thing. I really always struggle when somebody told me what to do. I just wanted to do it my way. And, you know, you mix those things together. And I think it's common. I think I think people look up to entrepreneurship, and yeah, because, I mean, you see the big success stories, and the hard work, and the impact it can make. But I think that the commonality, I think, with most entrepreneurs is that it doesn't feel like a choice for better or for worse. They're just geared in a certain way where they wouldn't be able to be effective. I admire somebody that can build a big, beautiful career in a, you know, in a fortune 500 like, I don't think I have what it takes to do that. So, I think it's just more about like being wired a certain way. And it's not about being better or worse. It's just being wired differently.

Leah 08:08

Right. It's not better or worse; it's just different. Yeah, to your point, having interviewed, you know, many Founders now, there is a common theme that runs through them, and you're right. I think they often say that phrase; I'm just wired a little differently.

Nic 08:21

You think about entrepreneurship; it takes so many no's it takes, like, if it was obvious, somebody else would be doing it, and half the time, the ideas, or more than half the time, the ideas turn out to be terrible. And then you have to try something else. You know, I had a lot of false starts before, ultimately, before I found Helcim. But you have to have something in you that just that is kind of like screaming against what actually makes sense. And then sometimes it all, everything lines up, and it makes sense. And then it makes sense in retrospective, but.

Leah 08:54

Right. I loved what you said there, that if it was easy, somebody else would be doing it. But that takes a lot of courage then to have this vision and just keep going. When, to your point, everybody's saying, no, no, no, I don't see it.

Nic 09:07

I appreciate saying courage. But I ultimately don't necessarily think that it's what's the driving factor. I think it's survival. You see a lot of entrepreneurs in immigrants, and I don't think necessarily comes from a place of like, going around, like, moving to a different country, and going through that experience is extremely courageous. But I don't think that like the choice of entrepreneurship came from a place of courage. I think it comes from a place of survival and just needing to just find a way to either find financial security and do something that you know, or just finding a way to prove yourself. But I think it comes from, like, survival, in the sense of, like, needing to do what you were meant to do. Or, like, you know, because if you come here when you've got what you see in a lot of immigrants, so they might have been very qualified from where they came from, they come here, and everything is reset. And then you're given two options, which is just like, do a career, potentially, that is, like, you're much over qualified to do, and unfortunately, the system isn't letting you step into what you're trained to do, or just step into something where you're just going to be in charge yourself, and you don't need anybody's permission, and that's what kind of ends up happening.

Leah 10:13

It does. It absolutely does. Okay. So, we've talked a little bit about sort of your first company, but how did you get to Helcim?

Nic 10:19

It's through the web design. So, you know, as we were getting more clients and starting to become a little bit more successful, at least, you know what success looks like for a 16-18-year-old?

Leah 10:29

I can't believe that.

Nic 10:31

This is before the Shopify days, and we started doing a lot more e-commerce websites. So, people come to us say, hey, I want to kind of sell something online. Is whether it's a service and I need somebody to program it. So, then got into more. I'm a self-taught programmer, so we started more into the coding side of things, and programming back ends, and setting up e-commerce from scratch. And then came the question of payments. So, they're like, Okay, now I gotta plug in payment acceptance. At the time, there's essentially PayPal already, but it already but it already had the reputation it has today, which was terrible, and the only kind of real other option was, like, going to one of the big banks, like Desjardins, and that was, you know, a very, not so pleasant experience to go through so and, you know, so that the gear started turning, going, is there something here? Is this something that we could get into? And ultimately, that started to, there's kind of two versions of Helcim. There's the Helcim that people see today, which really launched in 2020, and I kept the name primarily because we still had some good five-star reviews piggyback on that. But it's a new business. But there's the old Helcim I had started over a decade ago, which got into reselling payment services and trying to blend that with e-commerce. And kind of took a lot of like left turns and right turns trying to make it work. But the seed of it was web design, e-commerce, the payment friction and going, Hey, maybe we could do something better than the banks.

Leah 11:53

But this is what I always like to explore with Founders, is that, you know, a lot of people can still get to that conclusion, huh? There's something here that needs to be fixed, or I've got an idea for this, but they don't move on it; they don't act on it. Or even if they do, they don't have any idea or the perseverance or resilience that it takes to keep moving on it. Talk a little bit about how you overcame all of that.

Nic 12:15

I'll still lean on the survival. I mean, it's just like trying to make rent. I had to move in back in my parents a few times, because I couldn't afford it, but you've got something in your mind is like, I got to figure this out. I want to figure out this opportunity. And then I think you fall into almost like an entrepreneurial trap. And I say that it sounds negative, but I think it's both where you go down this path. And what's amazing about entrepreneurship is that you develop all of these skills, right, yet they are not transferable very well on a resume. So, you end up going like, Well, okay, now I'm 25, you know, I've got this business that's, you know, it's got some success, some not at least, I can pay some basic bills. If you have those dark moments going, like everybody has those, like, you know, do I keep going? Is this where I want to, you know, is this the success I really wanted? Is this, you know, am I actually going to be able to scale this thing? Is this a good idea or a bad idea? But then you go like, Well, what else am I going to do? Like, my resume is getting less and less applicable to, like, actually finding a job. And that's probably not true, you know, you can probably spin it.

Leah 13:19

You probably spin it.

Nic 13:20

You can probably spin it, but in your head, you just kind of going like, well, I can't do anything else. I gotta figure this out. And I think there's also just a for some of us, there's a determination of, like I, you know, ultimately, wanting to prove to yourself in the world that like you can be the success that you have in your head. And then so you just keep going and going and going. So, I think I still go back to, I don't think I don't fit as much courage as survival.

Leah 13:41

As for survival, I like that too. You said this vision that you have in your head of what you want it to be. Are you there yet?

Nic 13:49

We're getting closer.

Leah 13:50

That's exciting.

Nic 13:51

The thing with our companies, you know, we started in payments. We were essentially a reseller for the banks. It's the best way I like to describe it is like think about being like an insurance broker and not the insurance company, right? So, like, you can build yourself a nice business. You can be successful as a broker, but you're never really in control, back to that control thing, you know? You're never, ultimately, like you are in the shadow of the insurance company, saying that analogy, right? And for us, we were in the shadow of a bank, and we built ourselves, you know, a good business, and it was growing, and we got up to about 30 people and like staff on hand and 6000 clients, that felt like a small success, but we ultimately were thought like we could do something so drastically different, so much better for the small business customers that we service, but we got to get out of the shadow of the bank, and that took years. It took years and years and years because, ultimately the banks in the payments world and then the financial world are still the ones in control. You know, even if you think about all the, doesn't matter any kind of FinTech, if you think about like Neo banks or anything like that, there's always a bank in the background that has to sponsor them, right? You can't get away with it. So, ultimately we knew that we had to go build those relationships and convince/find a partner that would kind of let us do it on our own. It took many years, many hitting my head against the wall. I literally said to our bank partner at some point in exasperation, look, you've got new comments like square and stripe that are essentially like Godzillas in the streets, you know, flipping downtown upside down and like, yes, you might create, if you give us this license, you might create a monster out of us. But at least but at least we'll be your monster.

Leah 15:23

Right. And how do they respond to that?

Nic 15:25

Something clicked, finally, because they said yes at some point. And then we went down this, this crazy journey, which ultimately kind of launched Helcim of what you see, it in 2020, and to go back to your question, yeah, we think we're a whole lot closer at delivering on that mission, that promise, than we ever were. But it's, it was quite a, you know, twisty road to get there.

Leah 15:43

I bet. Let's explore the twisty in a minute. But give me the Helcim 101, where are you today? Where are you at?

Nic 15:49

We service 10s of 1000s of customers across Canada and the US, primarily small businesses. And, you know, the word small business kind of gets used a lot. And what does it mean? We really focus on kind of two groups. So, we have, like, traditional, we call it kind of traditional small business. Think about like vets, and dentists, and accountants, and auto-mechanics like, you know, like the kind of traditional business that is typically serviced by a bank. And then now we're standing here servicing a more to like the startups and tech-enabled businesses, and we're starting to partner with those as well. We have 160 staff, Calgary-based, and we're starting to, like our launch in 2020, we're starting to grow really quickly. So, we did our Series A investment in 2022, we just did our Series B in 2024, and, yeah, it's exciting. Everything feels on fire and exciting all at once. But that's part of the journey.

Leah 16:38

It is part of the journey. How does it feel when you're at this stage, and you look back, and you go, Wow, I can't believe we've gotten this far.

Nic 16:47

You never have, at least I never have.

Leah 16:47

Is that right?

Nic 16:49

I probably need to look back and appreciate more. But, like, you are so, so determined on the next step four, and it's 1000 little steps, and you're just like, it's so hard to, like, look up. I wonder if, whether it's through whatever's the next kind of giant milestones, whether it's like, you know, I'd love to go IPO, for example, maybe it's moments like that where you just kind of like, have a moment of realization, but even then, you're probably just focusing on the next step forward that I don't know, I don't know when the Oh, look at what's been built, kind of moment appears.

17:21

Wow, I mean, there are so many things I want to ask you about, but let's go back to when you were just a teenager, and you're building your business, and you've got this line of sight into something that maybe is going to be even bigger. You were so young at the time. Explain to me what it was like being that young and being the boss even. What was that like?

Nic 17:39

Yeah. I mean, I'm sure it was a terrible boss because there's like, so little management training. I think the biggest thing was, you know, because we're in FinTech, because we're in finance, there was the try and convince our customers that they could entrust with their money. That was very challenging, especially when it gets better because, you know, you convince one, then you leverage the hell of this customer to say, like, hey, you know Jane over here. Trust me. Let's go to Bob, and hopefully, he can trust me because Jane trusted me, and now Jane and Bob trust me. Okay, maybe Robert can, you know, so it's kind of, so, I think there's that piece, and over time, you get bigger and bigger, and that helps and convincing a bank or any kind of like financial partner to go like, I mean, we ultimately end up partnering with a with an American bank, and most of our partnerships have, even though we service both Canada and the US, unfortunately, Canadian banks never open a door. We just, they would just, like, slam the door on her. And I, on one side, I kind of understand, like, you know, you're you're 24 years old, and you look like a punk, and nobody wants to, like, open the the door for you. But on the other side, I think that something I admired more on the US kind of ecosystem, in general, is that they are just more risk-forward as a culture. And I think that that's part of how we limit ourselves in Canada, is that we don't we're so slow to open doors. And there's especially that kind of the incumbents and them, those kind of monopolies and analogies, like they need to do a better job at fostering ultimately, you know, like, you know, we still have to give a portion of our revenues back to our partner bank. That's how these kind of structures work, right? And it's an American bank that's benefiting from that because they open a door. And it could have been money that's going back to a Canadian scene. It's not. And so there's, yeah.

Leah 19:15

They have some work to do, for sure. Yeah, I also think about the cultural aspect of it too, like, you know, Americans, maybe yet, to your point, what you said with their less risk averse, you know, and there's that sort of fear in Canada still, and I wonder if that will change over time. What do you think?

Nic 19:32

I think we need to as a nation. We launched our services in Canada, and when we were about to launch in the US, we had this fear of, like, will they want to do business with the Canuck, and the reaction was so different. It actually surprised us because I think this is a bit of a stereotype, but I think Canadians, in general, are so much more risk-averse that, you know, convincing them to switch from, like, yeah, they hate their bank, their bank has a bad contract, bad fees, about everything, yet they're just like, oh, but, you know, I don't know. I kind of, I kind of, I kind of trust it, or I, you know, versus, first of all, what was different is that you there is none of that loyalty to the big incumbent banks in the US, like, nobody's like, loyal to or at least nobody like, you know, at the majority, you don't see this default loyalty from consumers and businesses in the states towards like City Bank or Bank of America. Like, they don't think that way, right? They're like, you know, you got a good reputation, you got the right rates. Let's do business-like, it's just the doors open so much easier. It's a different mindset. And I think there's so many wonderful things about our country in terms of, like, the foundation of it, the safety net, in terms of our social programs, the stem concentration, the education. Like we have so many good, we are a smart, clever nation, and there are so many good things that could be or more good things that could be happening for us. But we just play it too safe. Toby, the founder of Shopify, said recently, you know, it's like Canada's the country that goes for bronze. And, I mean, that hits hard. I'm sure there's a lot of entrepreneurs on this podcast that go like, wow, that's not, you know, it's like, I get it. But I do think this is a nugget of truth in there that we need to kind of get out of our shell more and flex what we've got.

Leah 21:16

Flex it. Yeah, because it's pretty special. Yeah.

Leah 21:16

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Leah 21:45

Let's talk a little bit now about what it's like to be you managing a company when you've got, what did you say? 150-160 employees now, yeah. How is that different than when you're a 25-year-old punk?

Nic 21:58

I mean, everybody warned me at like the 100, you know, 80 to 100 employee mark. That's when everything when everything changes. And it's definitely it; you can't know everybody's names. Communication becomes super important. That's, you know, I think some of the growing pains we' had been going through, or are around, like management layers. And you realize that, like at 20 people, at even at 50 people, the way that you manage, the way that you set the culture can really kind of influence the whole company, but a certain point, it's absolutely you’re one or two layers down from you that are actually setting the expectations of culture and performance and expectations and everything. And unless you really invest into that, it just doesn't quite materialize to what you want it to be. So, we've kind of realized that we've been investing more heavily into it. It's difficult. I think some people really thrive in a smaller company. Some people, like, you know, kind of the entrepreneurs I talk to are, like, at a certain size, I just want to sell. That's not wrong, but I think others, like, I mean, I did the small business thing for a long time, and now I'm just, like, eager to learn more, and even, you know, I'd love to go public and really create Helcim into that one of the kind of anchor tech tenants of the city, kind of like what Shopify did in, you know, for Toronto and Ottawa. And then people go, Well, you don't want to be a publicly traded CEO. That sounds awful. And I'm like, there's pros and cons to everything, but I'm just ready to learn the next steps of that journey, not stay stale.

Leah 23:21

Yeah, you don't strike me as one that would be like just plateauing. Yeah, you're climbing, always.

Nic 23:24

That's the goal.

Leah 23:25

That's the goal. Exciting, but being an entrepreneur, of course, has a lot of demands on you and your time. I'm really curious about how you manage being an entrepreneur and an aggressive builder with having a family life.

Nic 23:40

That's a tricky, loaded conversation. I have a newborn, you know, eight weeks old.

Leah 23:45

Eight weeks old. Congratulations.

Nic 23:48

It's an amazing amount of love and chaos all at once.

Leah 23:49

Isn't it?

Nic 23:50

I'm a believer that you can have it all. You just can't have it all at once. And I don't know if you've ever heard about The Four Burners Theory. So, it's essentially about, like, I'm a big believer in, like, compromise and trade-offs because I don't think you can all have it all at once. And The Four Burner Theory is essentially, you only have think about, like, a stove, stove top, right? With four burners, right? And it's like, one of them is family, one of them is friends, one of them is health, and one of them is professional success. And you only have so much gas. You cannot run all those things at the same time. And you really have to make the choices of, like, how are you throttling those burners? It can get a little bit drastic in terms of, like, if you want to be good at something, you got to turn off one. If you want to be great at something, you got to turn off two, right? That gets a little bit cringy. So, let me be more towards, like, the modulation of what that means, but ultimately it's tricky. I mean, you have to make choices in terms of, for me, you know, the financial success and the business success and what I want to create, and the impact I want to make for the city, and for myself, and for this company, and for small customers, is super important, and it's a huge part of my drive. And I don't have many friends because of that, and that's one of the burners that, you know, unfortunately, kind of goes, right. And even when it comes to, like, personal time or anything like that, like, I'm a believer in having not, like, a non, no compromise. One thing that you're willing to, like, say, like, you know, and for me, it's sleep, which is super, like some people, it's working out. Some people, it's, you know, time with watching a movie, or whatever is you're kind of like, you're no compromise. For me, it's sleep. So, I've had to do and that's harder with.

Leah 25:28

I was going to say and how does that work with a newborn?

Nic 25:31

But it's like, what else am I willing to sacrifice and compromise on and turn off and really like, you know, and just going like, okay, my priorities are spending time with my wife and my newborn son, spending as much as I can into the business, and seeing if I can get a little bit of the, you know, sleep in there, and everything else kind of goes out the window. And you know, is that I think a lot of people would kind of not find that the ideal for themselves. But, you know, I don't see it as a forever thing. I see it as, you know, I want to hit a certain level. And hopefully it's kind of, it's ultimate delayed gratification, right? So, it's like you just, you know, I used to joke about, like, freedom 30 and then freedom 35, now I’m almost 40. So, it's, maybe it's freedom 45 is what I'm aiming for, but it's just like making that choice of, like, I'm gonna have to make a whole lot of compromises in a lot of aspects of my life because I want the entrepreneurial burner to burn so hot, and hopefully I'm in a position later in life that I can shift those burners and enjoy the fruits of that labour.

Leah 26:36

It sounds like you've been very mindful of those four burners that you're very aware of what this looks like when you have to throttle it. It's not something that you just sort of forget about. It sounds like you're mindful of it like that. You might, like, think of those four burners every day.

Nic 26:50

If you don't have your eyes open going into this thing, it's just gonna, like, smack you so like, because, I mean, it's so demanding, it's such a that you know, at least you know being aware of, like, knowing what you want and knowing what the trade-offs are, and knowing where you need to compromise, knowing where you need to ask for compromises from others. And it helps at least, you know, being aware of, it helps navigate the roller coaster and the emotions of it also.

Leah 27:16

Let's talk about those roller coaster of emotions. I mean, I hear it all the time when, when they're in the chair, there. It is so many super, super highs and super, super lows. Would you agree?

Nic 27:26

It’s interesting that and how fast it switches. So, you can start the day feeling like you're the king of the world and like, maybe you got a big contract, or you got, you know, some like huge news on something, and end the day with, like, feeling like you are terrible at what you're doing, and it's all falling apart. And like it happens, you know, daily, weekly, monthly, it's the highs are highs, the lows are lows. I know that's cliche, but that's like, certainly part of it. And I wish I was, you know, one thing I'm trying to work on this year more is, like, celebrating the small things more because you just, they kind of help you even out a bit. But yeah, it's definitely a roller coaster.

Leah 28:06

You know, I hear this, and as a non-entrepreneur, I'm thinking to myself, like, why would you do this to yourself? But it sounds like for you, you had no other choice.

Nic 28:15

Yeah, I mean, or at least in my head, I had no other. Or at least it feels like now, without getting a little bit too kooky, but it feels a little bit like Manifest Destiny, in terms of like you're doing what you were supposed to do, even if it's a, you know, crazy journey, and there's just, you know, moments of near-death or anything like that, like it's just you just like you feel like you're like, this is my path.

Leah 28:38

Okay, so how do you negotiate those near-death moments when you're right down at the bottom?

Nic 28:43

I'll give you one like we had just like two years ago. We had just closed our Series A, top of the world again, yeah, like, Oh my God, look, I you know, this is a huge milestone, first time bringing in institutional investors. And two weeks after closing our Series A, we've been working on a physical product called our smart terminal, which is, you know, allowing more established businesses to accept payments. And you kind of see those at the countertop with big, bright screen and, and we've been working with this manufacturer in Hong Kong, and it's been like it was, you know, a million dollar plus investment and kind of putting everything together. We're about to put in a big manufacturing ortho with them two weeks after the close, and then they ghost us, and we're just like, what's going on? This is an established company. There's others in the space using them like, what's going on, and then we get a notice, like an official legal notice, saying that they've just been acquired by one of our competitors, Stripe, and they're turning us off. It was one of those moments where you go from a crazy high to a crazy low. Hadn't even had my first board meeting yet. First time having a board meeting, a board, and the first thing I need to do is, like, set up an emergency board meeting and saying, like, we just lost our manufacturer. Stripe kicked us out. That was definitely a low. And then you're kind of going into, you kind of have to get, you know, you kind of, like. You know, gonna curl up in a ball for about 24 hours, and then you get out of it, and you're like, kay, we're we gotta go everywhere in the world to find who else can help us with that. And you go through this whole journey, and ultimately, it was a multi year journey. We ended up finding an amazing partner out of Taiwan that, ultimately we think worked out better. But yeah, it's just that's, those are the roller coasters that you're riding. It's also a reminder that you're trying to take on banks. You're trying to take on huge, you know, tech startups, like some of the biggest names in not just in payments, but the biggest names in tech, like Square and Stripe and PayPal, like, they're just, they're monsters, right? And they've got, you know, they've got really big feet with really big toes, and they can crush your toes. Those are the moments that test you. Of like, how determined are you? And how much do you believe in your mission, and how much do you believe there's a space for you in this market to really decide, like, do you keep going?

Leah 30:58

What does it feel like when you're curled up in that ball on the floor for 24 hours?

Nic 31:01

Everybody story looks shiny on the outside, right? You see success stories, and then you just assume that it was just all kind of success.

Leah 31:11

Sure, easy, yeah.

Nic 31:13

And I think that there are some circumstances like, we look at the lotteries, you know, you look at Mark Zuckerberg and Facebook, and that's what entrepreneurs are. Like, that's the lottery. Not to take away from his efforts and everything. But it just, you know, that's not a clear example. But I think in those moments, those kind of, like, you know, near-death entrepreneurial experiences, like, you start questioning every like, the imposter syndrome kicks in hard, right? You're like, am I? Am I terrible negotiator? Am I terrible at business? Am I terrible this? Am I like, am I, you know, am I just kidding myself, you know, like that absolutely runs through your head. And I would say to, you know, any entrepreneurs listening to this like, it's just like, you are not alone. It's just even the ones that find more success; everybody is going through that pretty continuously. And I think that's a fun part about entrepreneurs talking to other entrepreneurs. And you kind of start sharing some of those, like, you know, f-up stories, near-death stories and everything, and you're like, oh, okay, maybe it's messy everywhere.

Leah 32:15

I mean, that's one of the reasons why I love this podcast, not to toot my own horn, but just because I get to talk to Founders about those moments and how did you move through it? So, I've got to ask you, so you're curled up in the ball, it's 24 hours later, how did you go? Okay, let's lose the imposter syndrome and just keep moving forward. What was happening for you?

Nic 32:35

Now, entrepreneurs will recognize this. You just you start making a list of like, what's the problem we're trying to solve, and who can help us solve it, and who knows who. And then you just lose any fear of conflict or rejection or anything, and you just pick up the phone or start sending out emails and then one thing leads to another, and you start exploring. And I think you just do.

Leah 32:57

You just do. And does the doing help with the emotional impact of it, because I'm imagining, like, emotionally, that’s got to hurt?

Nic 33:04

I think it allows you to feel a little bit more in control you have, whatever little control you have, right? And I think ultimately, I remember seeing a Twitter about, like, you know, the thing about this modern kind of information-based economy and this, you know, technology that we build right it's kind of like, it's a lot of like, if you just hit the right keys on the keyboard in the right order, enough, then you win at the end. It's just like thinking about and what I like about that is that like thinking about, like, ultimately, like, as long as we're breathing, as long as we have the means to keep going, there's a path. You just have to keep trying.

Leah 33:41

Wow. And thank you for saying, you know you're not alone out there to all the other Founders listening to this that are just a little bit farther behind. It's so true. Okay, so we're jumping back to present day now, and you've talked a little bit about how sleep is really important to you. But are there other things that you do to really fill up your own personal tank, to stay well and keep going?

Nic 34:02

Probably not as much as I would want to. I, you know, I find ways to to kind of get a workout in, and that helps with, like, the anxiety, and it helps with the sleep. Then spending time with my wife and my son now is probably the best way that I get and kind of rejuvenate. But I've always been somebody that's willing to sacrifice a lot, and in the end, I love my work. I genuinely, like, that doesn’t mean I love every day, but I genuinely, I feel very fortunate to do what I do, and so that, like, it doesn't matter if you throw me a marketing problem or a supply chain problem or whatever it is, like, Oh, cool. I get to type on the keyboard and come up with a plan and interact with people, and if you have a general love of business, and I think that's what, you know, kind of going a little into payments. On the surface, people like, oh, payment sounds boring, right? You're like, you know, if you're at a cocktail I don't know the last time I was at a cocktail party. But if people ask about, like, what do you do? Payments? On the surface, that sounds boring, but what I love about it is that if you have a love of business, you get a front-row seat into so many companies and the way that they operate. You know, we service everything from a restaurant, to a brewery, to a tire manufacturer, to an embassy, to a theatre, to like everything, and to dentists, everything in between, right? Like, and if you love business, you really get to explore an amazing range of just like, how the world, or how the economic heartbeat works, and payments gives us a front-row seat. And then so, like that love, I think, is part of the reason I'm in this industry, and ultimately that love of business in general, allows you to just take on the next challenge and be like, Oh, this. I just find every topic interesting and good because, like, every day seems to be like, I'm tackling a different topic.

Leah 35:57

Right. That's so interesting. So, that leads nicely into this notion of impact. At Thin Air Labs, we talk about creating meaningful human impact, and impact comes a lot, comes up a lot in these conversations. When you think about creating impact, what does that mean for you at Helcim?

Nic 36:13

Yeah, it's a good question. I look, I'm not going to pretend that like there's so many startups that work, you know, in health-tech or clean-tech, or in charitable givings or so on, that I think could more directly link what they do to, like, a positive impact in the world. I process credit cards like it's not as thrilling on the surface, but I mean, we do, like, you know, our missions to be the world's most loved payments company. That's a bit of an oxymoron because nobody loves their payments. But we really mean it. We think that, like, I think that can came from falling in love with small businesses and the ones that gave me a shot, and, like, seeing how poorly they are treated to this day by some of the big names I mentioned, and going like, yeah, we can do better. And that seems like a righteous kind of like mission because ultimately, small businesses account for, you know, 90 plus percent of employment and our economy, and they deserve a shot. So, I think that keeps us, and when we have people join, when we say, like, you know, working non-stop is really demanding, and you really have to find behind the job, why are you here? Some people are here because they love the culture that we've created, and we love working with super kind of talented, dense people. Some people are here because, you know, they come from a small business background, or their parents came from a small business background, and they wanted to have that impact, and they believe in the mission, right? Some people are at our company because they love the idea of building and having that impact in Calgary, in terms of that the tech ecosystem that we're building, and being part of something big, and ultimately, you know, for me, it's probably a combination of of all of those things. But, you know, you gotta anchor when you're part of a startup, you gotta anchor yourself to, like, one of those things, because there's gonna be some, like, hair on fire moments, and you go like, wow, I can make better money somewhere else. Why am I here? And it's like, well, you know, outside of the stock options, there has to be a reason that that keeps you driven.

Leah 38:06

I totally understand that, Nic. I hear what you're saying about the link to the life science companies, for example. That's that's a direct, easy-sight line to the impact. But yeah, when you think of those small business owners and the impact they're creating and the impact that you're having on them, that's huge.

Nic 38:21

And I think, ultimately, like, you know, it's cliche, but we think they deserve better. They don't deserve, you know, three year contracts and hidden fees and terrible customer service and banks that take them for granted. That's, you know, on one side, we're very fortunate because we get to sell a service that is a must-have. You know, small businesses will turn off their lights before they turn off their payment machine because they need to get paid. But on the other side, we also get to compete with a lot of D players in this space. You know, a lot of a lot of like old school banks that have taken it for granted. So, you know, we love kind of coming in, being like they deserve better. We can do better, and our competitors aren't trying that hard. So.

Leah 39:06

You like shaking it up. He's got a huge grin on his face right now, just for the record. Okay, so when we think about wrapping this up, you're the Founder, and you're writing the story for Helcim and for your company. How do you hope the story goes?

Nic 39:20

Ultimately, I mentioned a few times we'd love to take the company public when we get to the right size, and for a number of reasons, it's not; I don't see my public as like as an exit. Sure, it brings liquidity, and that's that's nice for everyone involved, investors and stakeholders and employees and, but ultimately, I see it. You know, going public brings you into the public conversation the way that private companies typically don't, right? I think so. Also, you become part of the public discourse. You become, you know, like and also.

Leah 39:50

Why is that important?

Nic 39:51

I think, I mean, there's the kind of very selfish element of that, which is, like, brand awareness. But I also think that, like, it helps put the city that you're working, you know, in and that you love,  and I really do love Calgary, on the map. And I think that ultimately success would be, you know, we grow the company to this size where it's a meaningful player in the Canadian Space, the US space. And then when people think of, like, oh, what's tech in Calgary? It's like, Helcim. Just like Shopify was able to do that for Toronto. And I think they were kind of like the, really, like the really kind of big beacon for that city. And I think we could do that right here in Calgary, and that would be just a stepping stone to just build world domination while helping our small business customers.

Leah 40:33

I love it. I love it. And then, as a Founder, you're a Founder of this incredible company. How do you hope your personal story goes?

Nic 40:41

I mean, I'd love to build, continue to build a team that just that talent density and that that kind of the drive for excellence that ultimately is able to go and spin off into all of their own adventures and just help build the ecosystem into, you know, what it can be.

Leah 41:01

Nic, thank you for this conversation.

Nic 41:02

Thanks for having me.

Leah 41:11

As the lead investor in Thin Air Labs - Fund One, Sandstone Asset Management believes in building the commons through innovative founders who are creating meaningful, positive impact, both locally and globally. Sandstone is doing just that by backing the next generation of emerging entrepreneurs. Picture this: a founder start-up goes from idea to international impact supported by strategic investors who believed in their vision. That's the power of Sandstone's approach. Sandstone doesn't just manage wealth; they cultivate it, supporting founders at all stages. Visit sandstoneam.com to learn how sandstone builds legacies that last.

Calgary is a city of innovative companies ideas and talent. The Opportunity Calgary Investment Fund is investing in Calgary's future by finding, fueling, and fostering innovation to build a diverse and resilient economy. Find out more at opportunitycalgary.com

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