Chenny 00:02

And for me, I'm just like, How can I do this for 10 people? And then once I do it for 10 people, it's like, okay, now how can I do it for 100 people? And then once you do it for 100 people, it's like, okay, how can I do this for 1000 people? Starting with just how can I make a big difference for this end user that I'm looking to make a difference for? Even if it's just a handful of people. It's an evolutionary process.

Leah 00:26

Hi, thanks for being here and welcome to Season Two of The Founder Mindset, brought to you by ATB. I'm Leah Sarich, your host, and I'm super excited to talk to more founders about the human experience of being an entrepreneur. In this podcast, we're digging into what it really feels like to build a company from nothing. I was a broadcaster for over 20 years. So, I've interviewed thousands of people, but entrepreneurs, not that many, and yet they have the best stories. They're solving big problems and they're creating incredible impact. But it is hard work. So, why would they do this? Let's find out.

Leah 01:12

Joining me today is Chenny Xia the Co-Founder and CEO of Gotcare, a company connecting homecare workers with the patients who need them. Specializing in bringing personalized data-driven and effective care from urban centers to rural locations across Canada. Chenny, thanks so much for being here today.

Chenny 01:29

Thanks for having me.

Leah 01:30

Awesome. Well, as you know, this is called The Founder Mindset. So, let's go back in time, and let's figure out when did you first become an entrepreneur? Am I right that you were just 16?

Chenny 01:41

Yeah, I was in university. So, I went to university when I was 15. And then I was working basically two minimum-wage jobs. I worked at a coffee shop in the morning to open and then I went to school, and then I napped, and then I worked at events in a hotel at night. And that's just like, wow, this is just not a reasonable existence.

Leah 02:06

Yeah, no kidding.

Chenny 02:08

I was a pretty accidental entrepreneur. At the time, I was studying design in school. And I thought, well, what if I just like, did some freelance work, instead of this, like, you know, minimum wage stuff. So, I basically helped design websites and apps while I went to school. And then I ended up getting a decent amount of work that way that I then brought on some of my classmates that I was studying with, and then lo and behold, it became a business. That was my first business.

Leah 02:43

And you laugh. And you think this is incredible, Chenny. And first of all, like, we have to just go back to what you said that you started university when you were 15.

Chenny 02:52

I had a non-ideal upbringing. And so I was very motivated to be a working human. Like now, it seems crazy, but at the time, it seemed totally reasonable. I like did all of the night school and summer school that one could take, because I was just obsessed with like, getting to work as soon as possible. Because I was like, this is what's going to make my family circumstance better. Anyway, so that was my motivation.

Leah 03:18

Clearly very motivating for you, obviously, that's incredible. Okay, so you had this product design business on the side there while you were just 16? How eventually did you get to Gotcare?

Chenny 03:29

So, I will say that first business ended up lasting me almost like nine years. Yeah, at our height, we were 16 people. We ended up doing a lot of work in health care. And so, specifically, ended up doing a lot of design thinking work and strategic design work for various different hospital networks, or homecare organizations as well. And it was kind of like, after years of making the same decks, giving advice on the same things, and sort of witnessing status quo really struggling to try something new. It was just sort of this like moment where I remember showering, I was just like, well, I can keep making decks on the same thing or I can just do the thing.

Leah 04:23

I can just do the thing.

Chenny 04:25

I could just do that. Yeah. And on one of my last initiatives, as you know, play more of like a consulting kind of context. It was for a consortium of various different home health providers across the country. My now co-founders were also consultants on that initiative, too. And we kind of looked at each other and we had a heart-to-heart conversation of like, what would it be like for us to literally fire ourselves from this consortium, and get their blessing to do this as a venture? Because there was clearly no appetite to transform how things could be done, it required like a total restructuring of operations, of sales, it was just asking too much for a large organization to change all at once, it was just actually easier to build as like a standalone thing. And that we could service them instead. So, yeah, we ended up getting their blessing. And, you know, actually, a couple of those executives ended up becoming angel investors in the business too.

Leah 05:28

Let's get everybody up to speed on what Gotcare actually does and what it's all about.

Chenny 05:33

Yeah, so at Gotcare, we deliver as much care as we can, in the home setting. We're all about prolonging independence, self-functioning, self-management, of chronic conditions, disabilities, recovering from whatever it is that you're recovering from, in the home setting. It's where people are comfortable, it's where people mostly prefer to receive their care. And also bringing in virtual supports and technology to personalize their experience and optimize safety as well.

Leah 06:06

Incredible. So, I have to ask, though, you're telling me how you and your co-founders, were just sort of thinking, you know, we could probably do this. But like, help me understand where you guys get the confidence to be just like, you know, what, we're just gonna do this ourselves. Like, this actually makes more sense for us just to do it ourselves. Where does that sort of confidence come from?

Chenny 06:25

Actually, at first of all, like, Who do we think we are, like, you know, these big gargantuan 1000’s of people company could totally do this better than us. And so we try to bring the thing that we do to like, the belly of the beast, so to speak, and try to get like, you know, we were like, oh, let's just do what it takes to get a major player to do this. And yeah, it's just change management, right? Like, at the end of the day is so hard. Like, especially when it's like, I like to say like, ideas are like puppies, you know, they're like, really sensitive, they're not good or bad, they just are. They need to be treated like puppies. Like, they're really delicate. And so the survival rate of like an idea like this, to actually succeed in a large enterprise. It's just, I mean, there's, I'm sure there's like, a lot you can read online about it, but it's just, it's just really low.

Leah 07:21

And yet, there's people have ideas all the time, but very few people actually activate those ideas and like, build a company around them. And yet, you guy’s did.

Chenny 07:30

I think that I would just make like, frankly, like a terrible employee.

Leah 07:36

Why is that? You gotta tell me why.

Chenny 07:39

I feel like if you've been an entrepreneur your entire life, and you know, and then you're supposed to not, like it's just, it's, I feel like when, if you choose the path of entrepreneurship, it's like, your default mode is like, Oh, I wonder if this could be a business.

Leah 07:56

So in fact, it is a mindset for you. It is really how you just approach the world.

Chenny 08:00

Yeah, pretty much.

Leah 08:0e

Yep. I love it. I love it. We wanted to talk a little bit in this podcast about what it's like, though, to be an entrepreneur, and to think like that all the time, and how it sort of affects your life. You know, the people in your life, how you live your life, that kind of thing? How does being an entrepreneur affect your personal life?

Chenny 08:22

It's more like what it doesn't affect. It impacts your friendships and people you choose to be in a relationship with, even the partner that you choose to have in life as well. Because it's a 24/7 thing, which comes with a lot of challenges. It's this crazy roller coaster, with some high-ups and a lot of low-lows. And surrounding yourself with people who you feel seen by is important. Building businesses like how long can your business survive for until it can like do hit its thing that it needs to do? Right, like so. Game of survival? I think it's really important to surround yourself with people who can really be there for you in that journey. And part of it is understanding where you're coming from and what it's like. So, yeah, so I end up having a lot of founder friends or friends who work at startups, and even my partner now, he's an entrepreneur himself too, which just makes things easier, because then that's like, Oh, I gotta do a thing like it. There's no need to explain anything. There's just a knowing about it. And I also think it's where you talk about your problems with the people that you love, because you're looking to be supported, like, being able to be understood, and that is important, too. Right? So, you don't feel alone. I think a lot of entrepreneurs feel really lonely. And so really being thoughtful about who you're surrounding yourself with so you aren't lonely. I think it's really important too.

Leah 10:00

You know, I agree with you, that's certainly a theme that's come up in, in a lot of previous episodes that it can be really lonely to be that entrepreneur and building something because a lot of people just don't get it. You know, I mean, that's one of the reasons why I started this podcast. Like, I'm like, why would you do this to yourself? You founder types? Like, it seems so hard.

Chenny 10:17

So, there's really no good reason on paper to do this. I just put in, I just Googled entrepreneur salary to give you an example. Okay. So, as of July 7, 2024, the average annual pay for an entrepreneur in Ontario is $41,964.

Leah 10:38

Wow.

Chenny 10:42

Yeah, right. It's, yes, of course, you have, like, your Bezos stories and stuff like that, but, but for the most part, you can make more money just working a tech job. You can't doing this. And so it's got to be motivated by something else?

Leah 11:01

For sure. I think we'll get into that in a little bit when we start talking about impact. But prior to that, I mean, you even told me that your dad was a bit concerned for you, you know, when you said like, I'm just gonna keep doing this entrepreneurial thing. And he's like, you're never gonna be an employee, are you?

Chenny 11:17

Like, are you sure? Are you sure you want effectively, like unstable employment where your whole life? But yeah, but there's also so much beauty in being able to have a container to do things differently, right? Like, I think the way that transformation happens is like, people who operate our status quo world, which is a wonder that everything still works, let's be honest, these days. It's like, they're doing such important work. That innovation is like a site of dusk thought most of the time, right? But yet, they need to run the thing, they need to run the thing that we all operate in today, it's really important function. So, then you have like an entrepreneur class, kind of like, on the sidelines being like, I'm gonna try to do my thing. But really, what you're doing is you're trying to build an alternative reality. But then people who are ensuring that status quo is held up, who can point to your alternative reality and be like, hey, look, look other people on my team. Look, there is another way to do something. They're doing it over there in their like, little microcosm, what if we brought some of that in? It requires both to really enable Systems Transformation.

Leah 12:33

But can we talk about the system that you're working in? I mean, the healthcare system, it is so slow to innovate in so many ways, and in many ways, when you could argue that it's quite broken right now, and at least very strained, does it not seem like almost untenable to actually try to make the change in that space?

Chenny 12:51

I think when you embark in a field where change is known to be hard, like healthcare, or education, you name it, right? You kind of have to be mindful about when you are listening and observing and adapting to what's happening. And also, when you kind of just have to put your blinders on a little bit and just do the thing. It's like, both at the same time. It's definitely a very challenging field to innovate in. But I also think that is where a lot of entrepreneurs are needed. Like, we don't need like another convenient way to like record a video.

Leah 13:35

I hear what you're saying, we really need innovation in healthcare. Yes.

Chenny 13:39

Yeah, and any of the other STEM fields that are quote-unquote, hard to innovate in.

Leah 13:44

Right, and so, I guess it comes back to that idea, like, it could be me. I could make this difference, I could actually build this future, to your point, this vision, this way of doing things that people can't see without my help.

Chenny 13:56

And for me, I'm just like, How can I do this for 10 people? And then once I do it for 10 people, it's like, okay, now how can I do it for 100 people? And then once you do it for 100 people, it's like, okay, how can I do this for 1000 people? Starting with just how can I make a big difference for this end user that I'm looking to make a difference for? Even if it's just a handful of people? It's an evolutionary process.

Leah 14:20

How did you learn to think like, one step at a time, and then we just grow and build on what we've done?

Chenny 14:25

Probably it’s because it's less overwhelming for my brain. It's like, what is within my control? I feel so overwhelmed. And I just like can't bring myself to take action because I don't know what to take action on. I think a lot of people get into that space, right? Where they're like, Oh, my God, this thing is so big, like, I don't know where to start. I don't know where to start. And yet the reality is like, it actually doesn't matter where you start. But the most important thing is that you just start and you start by like breaking it down into this one tangible action that you can take. Yeah, and like momentum creates momentum.

Leah 15:00

Absolutely, can you give me an example of that in the growth and evolution of Gotcare that one step at a time?

Chenny 15:07

Yeah, so, for example, we have this vision of being able to bring care to everyone in any rural community, regardless of where you live, you can have access to care, right? And you think about it from like, all of the factors that can go into the challenges of rural health delivery, often is coin like last-mile health delivery, you know, it's called last-mile delivery for recent right? People live two and a half hours away from their closest hospital, there are very few family doctors in rural communities, most of them are over the age of 65 and about to retire. You've got really challenging technology access issues, a lot of people don't have access to internet, you can't even get 3G access from their phone. There's just a lot of you know, you're socially you're more socially isolated from others in your community as well. So, there's like increased social loneliness and things like that. Like, there's a lot of challenges that go into rural health. And so for us, it was always well, how do we just start with one team? Like, where is there one health team? Doesn't matter what context and hospital, and family doctor’s office like? Literally any context, there must be a group out there, a small community of people out there who want the same things, and who have the same views have a good future for their community could look like as us like, me coming up with this thing with my team, we can't be the only team who has this idea. Right? Like there must be other teams who fit this way. And so it's just like, Okay, how do we find one team, who thinks this way and wants this thing to? And how do we just get in touch with them and talk about the thing? Like, it's kind of like that, instead of saying, Okay, well, gosh, what are all of the things I need to think about? Like, it's really just finding your people.

Leah 17:01

Find your people and build the thing, right?

Chenny 17:04

You can’t find the customer, then what are you building? Like, I really believe in co-creating and co-designing with your customer. It's like, as a startup, like you have some of the puzzle pieces, but they have the other puzzle pieces. And you gotta like put the pieces together, right? So yeah, huge advocate for co-design.

Leah 17:25

For co-design, that totally makes sense. That probably comes from your sort of product and design background, right?

Chenny 17:30

Yeah, yeah, I'm biased.

Leah 17:34

But maybe in a good way, for certainly building a venture, that's for sure. I ask every founder on this podcast, tell me about that one moment that do or die, or like sink or swim moment in the building of your venture, where you were like, I don't know if I'm gonna be able to figure this out, or I don't know if this is going to work. You and I've talked about this in the past. Tell me a little bit about that moment for you. I understand it had to do with the start of the pandemic.

Chenny 18:00

Yeah, so, okay, for context, right before the pandemic, I was voluntold to be CEO because we were about to fundraise. And my co-founder is the one with a clinical background, like not me, right? So, here I am, probably like, five months into being CEO, COVID becomes a pandemic there's literally no instruction for any community care providers on what to do, what not to do. And I think we had like just under 600 patients at the time you know, people were like, what's gonna happen? No answer. At the same time, just for background context, I had purchased a house the fall before and had decided in that fall to gut the house and just remodelled a little bit as well. And so, like I was living in an Airbnb, but then because things got locked down I decided to move back into the house because you know, you can't do home renovation without supervising it a little bit and I was like, maybe we go fully locked down like you can't even go on the streets, like who knows. So, like moved into this completely unfinished house that our general contractor prioritized like making the toilet run, literally. I had like a mattress on the ground, on a drop she was like all this like plastic lining around it and like that was my one space where everything was clean and not covered in drywall powder. So, it was like chaotic in my environment and then chaotic in the company too. And there was this moment I was like, Okay, now what? Thankfully, I have a business coach through a community called Coralus, previously ShEO and she literally talked about the phone and walked me off the cliff every single day. And in the end, it was one of those moments where it's like, okay, you know, we don't have the information we need to make a decision. So, what are we going to do? So, my co-founders and I decided to call every single patient that we worked with, and ask them, what good and safe would mean and feel like for them, like, literally, we divided up the list into three groups, and we just called, all of us. And we just adapted for what they wanted. Of course, common themes came out, right? And that's when we also started to introduce more virtual cueing, virtual sequencing, things like that. So, more of the care could be handled virtually as opposed to all being in person at the time. And yeah, and kind of like true to our principles of how we operate the business, but you talk to you, like I remember talking to getting an investor's advice during this time, and they were like God, like, calling all these people like that, that doesn't feel sustainable. Like, that doesn’t feel like a good idea. But just in our hearts, we just felt like no, this is the right thing for us to do. It's the most on-brand thing for us to do as well. And actually, like I would say, that was really the start of our virtual care business was through that process. And so looking back now, what we were doing at the time was just like meets discovery, and we were, you know, again, my co-creating solutions with our patients.

Leah 21:13

That's unbelievable.

Leah 21:16

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Leah 21:29

So, essentially, you're running your company, you’re a brand new CEO, and you're running it from your bed.

Chenny 21:46

Yeah, yeah, with drywall powder all around me.

Leah 21:50

All around you.

Chenny 21:52

The shower wasn't ready, at that point. And so I had like, you know, like the wipes you get when you go camping? That was the vibe.

Leah 22:01

Unbelievable. I mean, how did you personally like manage that even like, how did you get through that?

Chenny 22:07

A lot of somatic practices.

Leah 22:10

What does that mean?

Chenny 22:12

For me, somatic practices are practices that involve your body, it’s about being in your body, and being able to process your stress and tension in a healthy way to get it out of your body. Ideally, I feel like if you don't have the somatic practices like you can't, it's just so hard to make it through moments like that without completely burning out, or like have, you know, getting sick, right? Like stress is the number one cause of illness. So, for me, that can look like a lot of different things. I practice a very specific type of yoga called Yin Yoga. I practice a very specific type of breathwork called Kundalini, just like different things like that. For everyone, it's a little different in terms of what works for you. But really, it's like, how can you release the tension and stress that your body is carrying?

Leah 23:00

No kidding?

Chenny 23:08

Even if it's like, do the thing every 15 minutes for a few days.

Leah 23:08

I bet. Just to get through it? I mean, how did you come to a place where you were like, I need to deal with this stress? I mean, actually, I know you told me a story where previously you were hospitalized because of stress. So you learned, yeah.

Chenny 23:22

Yeah. Really early on, actually, it was back with my consulting business at the time. Yeah.

Leah 23:25

Tell me about that. What happened then?

Chenny 23:29

I mean, I think I was going to school. And I think our team was like four people at that time. Constantly thinking about like, okay, who else do we need to bring on the team while doing project work, while finding more project work to do? And I didn't do anything somatically I didn't do any physical exercise, even really beyond like walking from point A to point B. Yeah. And then one day I woke up and when I rolled over in my bed, my kidney hit my ribcage, and I just like wailed, cause apparently that hurts a lot. Yeah, called 911 and then ended up in the hospital and they told me that my kidney was four times the size it should be and yeah, basically happened overnight. There was like no build-up to it. It just kind of happened overnight. I actually stayed in the hospital for just under six months.

Leah 24:25

And this was because of stress?

Chenny 24:25

That was the final yes, by the attending physician at the time. They were like there is nothing else that we could tie this to, so we believe it was stress-related. Okay, thanks.

Leah 24:46

Wow, that is unbelievable. So, this makes sense to me now. So, this really informed how you were going to be moving forward. You obviously learned how dangerous it can be and now you're very thoughtful about looking after yourself as a founder.

Chenny 25:00

I mean, I think the stories are all over the place, like one of my closest friends, she went through YC in the US, and towards the end of the program, she ended up being diagnosed with cancer. I think the stories just come up again and again and again. But effectively, like as an entrepreneur, you're putting your body through a lot of stress, and a lot of interpersonal challenges. Constantly, all the time, like, conflict is the name of the game. And so like, if you don't have healthy ways to deal with this, then yeah.

Leah 25:33

It can be really dangerous. So, good for you for having learned from that situation. And now you're very mindful about how you work and live as an entrepreneur, so good for you. What do you want people to understand about that? Who might be listening to this in terms of how they should stay safe if they decide to become an entrepreneur themselves?

Chenny 25:51

Yeah, I mean, maybe this is like a little too out there. But like, I feel like, as an entrepreneur, a lot of the times, there's a lot of signs everywhere. Like, there's signs, when you're in a meeting, someone says something, your teammate says something, you see something happen when you go to an on-site, like a customer on-site, like, there's just little cues and hints for your business everywhere, if you pay attention. And those like little things that you pick up on, I find are often the things that like really help accelerate your business. But if you're like totally tired and worn down, you actually can't listen for those signs. You can't even see them. Because you're so focused on your to-do list, like your version of your to-do list, you're so focused on what like what your brain thinks is needed, that all these other signs become really hard to pay attention to. It's not an emergent process as a result, like, it's not an adaptive process, creating a product or service, like the act of creation is a fluid process. Like it's, you know, it needs that kind of spaciousness to exist. And so, the question I would ask for entrepreneurs early in their journey is, what can I do in my life to create more capacity for emergence to come? As opposed to me having all the answers all the time, if that's just like, unreasonable?

Leah 27:34

I love that. Creating space for emergence. I like that. That's amazing. We've talked a lot about the stress and anxiety when it comes to being an entrepreneur. But obviously, there's so much that you love about it. Let's talk a little bit about the bits and bobs of being an entrepreneur that you absolutely love.

Chenny 27:51

Yeah, one of the things I love the most is just like the kind of jobs that we create for people. A lot of the time, you know, people join our team, and they're like, Wow, I've never seen a job posting like this before, like being able to deliver health in this way. Like how cool, especially with healthcare jobs, vacancy rates are extremely high right now, for good reason. And so creating viable, inspiring jobs that people like is part of the thing. Like really seeing people come alive, when you give them permission to be like, hey, care can be delivered in this way, like, go and just see them bring their gifts in action when they're just given that little bit of permission to like, think differently, and act differently is really, really cool to witness. Another part of it is we give our customers a facilitated space to dream. So, for example, I was meeting with a renal unit at a hospital. And they've done things the way they've done things for a long time. And so even just curating and facilitating space for them to be like, Oh, wow, like, yeah, we can do things differently. And hosting, like we host a lot of co-creation workshops, where we bring in patients or patient representatives who bring in clinicians, we bring in folks from our team, like technologists, we bring everyone together and we sort of, you know, prioritize the problem areas. And we say like, Hey, like, all of the solutions, we have Gotcare, they're like Lego pieces, you can kind of configure them the way that works for you. Like, let's just see what happens. And even just giving people the pen to sort of do that, seeing that moment where their creativity is engaged. They're like, Oh, well, what about this, what about that? Like, even being in that mode is just so beautiful to witness too. And like we will come away from that being like, wow, that was such a lovely thing to be a part of like. I think giving people that space to dream, like to really dream something new. It's a really privileged experience that entrepreneurs get to have.

Leah 29:52

No kidding. No kidding. That leads so nicely into our conversation about impact. Impact is really important to us here at Thin Air Labs and I know it's important to Gotcare too. When you think of impact, what does it mean for you and what you're creating it Gotcare?

Chenny 30:07

Impact comes from, well, in the case of specifically social impact, it comes from the ability to bridge gaps in care. Whether that's access to care, whether that's time to care, whether that's a location of care, type of care. Really, it's about enabling something that people want that they can’t get, for whatever reason. And yeah, and that can also mean, so for example, at Gotcare, we pay 15% more to our frontline staff who deliver care in homes, we pay about 15% more than our competitors do on average. And it's because we know that increased pay means increased care consistency, and increased care consistency means better patient outcomes. And so even making those decisions, I think, a lot of the time, when we think of impact, we don't really think about like, what is our theory of impact, like? What's our theory of transformation? Like, what do we think needs to happen in order for transformation to be true? So, for example, for us, it's creating a bigger pool of workers who are working in the home, that people can access. Having access to digital tools to enhance virtual care, access and safety, and then also being able to create better-paying jobs. So, people actually, you know, the retention issue and turnover issue is not so much of an issue, because in Communicare, in particular, turnover can be up to 40% to 70% a year, depending on what geography you're in. And like really having a point of view on, well, these are the levers that need to change, in order for families to have access to consistent care, in order for time to care to be at a reasonable pace, where you're not waiting weeks and weeks for care. And so having a point of view on like, what are the levers that will lead to that? And, but also changing those levers if you aren't seeing that as well, right? Like, it's really just your theory of transformation.

Leah 32:20

That's incredible.

Chenny 32:21

Being able to track it.

Leah 32:22

And being able to track it. Yeah, and make sure it's working. You've also spoken about wanting to see more social entrepreneurship like this in the world. And that's also very motivating for you. Can you talk a little bit more about that?

Chenny 32:35

Yeah, I mean, I think social, like everyone knows what like, you know, what the typical venture scale at all costs, entrepreneurship path looks like, right? And unfortunately, there are just certain, especially social challenges where that type of growth model is not congruent with. And I think when you're a social entrepreneur, you think about your impact just as much as you think about profit. And so, it's really, you balance both at the same time. And a lot of investors, you know, even impact investors, like, there's a huge range, but a lot of them expect this 25x, 50x, I've even heard 100x return on their investment. And that's just not feasible when your mandate is increased health accessibility. It's just not the right problem to fit into that. And so as a result, you have this, you know, when you look at the portfolio of ventures globally, it's very clear that, you know, a lot of ventures solve this type of problem. And very few ventures solve a social problem, right? Like, it's just, just inherent. And I think that we don't really have a great means yet, of measuring impact in a way that investors and stakeholders can receive as a positive net benefit, in the same way that return on shareholder value can be clearly measured. And so like, yeah, there's like impact models and stuff like that, and blah, blah, blah, right? But like, at the end of the day, there isn't, you know, when the investor is still reporting on the return of their portfolio, they are typically reporting on financial return as their main thing, not the impact return. And so yeah, like it's, it's hard for us to value that thing as a result, in the way that it can be so that it is seen as equal.

Leah 34:51

Fair enough and you'd like to see that changed for sure. Makes sense. As we move to the end of this podcast, I want to ask you, you are the founder, you are writing the story for your company, for Gotcare. How do you hope the story for Gotcare goes?

Chenny 35:09

I mean, I think it's an emergent story. And I actually try to not hold the story too closely to my heart to have too much attachment for what that story is. For me, I like it to be like, Okay, I'm going to set an intention and then we're going to practice non-attachment. Where Gotcare is going is an intention is that we want to upskill and uplift community care workers across the country to play a larger role in healthcare delivery. Beyond just providing what we call traditional home care, working with family doctors working with hospitalists, working with specialists, working with family health teams, to be able to manage chronic conditions, disability, recovery, and more treatment options in the home setting. Because ultimately, that is where a lot of financial sustainability for programming can be found. It's much more convenient for families as well and involves the family caregiver in a much more cohesive way. And it takes advantage of the full breadth of the healthcare workforce that we have available to us, beyond just doctors and nurses, because we have crazy shortages that we're not going to fill in the next few years. And so in terms of how that becomes true like we are in the process, and we're totally emergent to that. We've partnered with hospitals, family health teams, and retirement homes, to sort of experiment with this in different ways with results and seeing results in different ways as well. But ultimately, there will need to be changes in regulation, changes in billing codes to facilitate this really at a much larger, sustainable scale, where it's much easier for companies to deliver care in this way. Yeah. And it's really like a collective journey, right? Like, it's not like we are a part of that frontier. But it's also us being in relationships with other organizations, who also want to see health care involved in that way.

Leah 37:25

That's incredible. And when you think of yourself as the founder of Gotcare, how do you hope your own story goes?

Chenny 37:33

I just hope to continue to have fun. You know, like, I think it's just really important to just keep having fun like that your job is fun. Yeah, because it can, it can be heavy, for sure. There's a lot of politics involved. There's a lot of change management involved. But yeah, like keeping things fun, holding things lightly, and I really subscribe to the servant leadership model. So, like a much more coaching-based model as opposed to like a dictator based model. And it's really beautiful to like see, like I said, to like, see our team expand and come alive on a lot of these initiatives.

Leah 38:17

And so you hope to just see more of that and keep it light. Wonderful. Chenny, thank you so much for this conversation.

Chenny 38:25

No worries.

Leah 38:35

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Leah 39:17

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